Comments on: How Free = More Money http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/ Internet Entrepreneur, Public Speaker, Blogger Sun, 23 Oct 2011 15:21:46 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Luigi Cappel http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-10430 Luigi Cappel Thu, 13 Nov 2008 20:13:31 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-10430 Guys I think some of you are thinking old school and trying to apply old advertising concepts to a new way of doing business and yes that is also how some Telco's are trying or even planning to work, perhaps where in some cases you will get free services instead of putting up with advertising which will probably still be scattergun. But that doesn't mean it has to be that way. Personally I hate advertising. I read a book or check an email when TV advertisements are on and will shortly bying an equivalent of Tivo so I don't need to worry about ads at all. I almost never read ads in print media unless it is a big sale ad of cool technology. But! If I was in a tourist area such as Queenstown in New Zealand and got a text coupon saving me 75% on the normal price of a jet boat ride because I am close to the wharf, but I have to be there within 10 minutes. I'm on that boat. If I am a member of the Stella Artois Happy Hour Club and I walk past a bar on Friday night and get a text coupon saying come in now and get 2 bears for the price of 1 and forward this message to your mates and we will tell them you are here and offer them the same deal, I'm in. Of course I would have already opted in and said that they can only send me deals on Friday evenings from 6 till 10 and only if I am within 500m of a bar offering a deal. Scattergun marketing annoys me to death. I don't want Spam about things I'm not interested in. If I can have a deal with an advertiser where I can set the rules for our communication including that they only send me things that I am genuinely interested in, I might start to like advertising. Given the state of the world economy and the growing population, advertisers will be able to offer better deals to targetted people with much greater results and the people receiving offers will be pleased they got them. Imagine a DM Campaign that gets 30% results reliably? Guys I think some of you are thinking old school and trying to apply old advertising concepts to a new way of doing business and yes that is also how some Telco’s are trying or even planning to work, perhaps where in some cases you will get free services instead of putting up with advertising which will probably still be scattergun. But that doesn’t mean it has to be that way.

Personally I hate advertising. I read a book or check an email when TV advertisements are on and will shortly bying an equivalent of Tivo so I don’t need to worry about ads at all.

I almost never read ads in print media unless it is a big sale ad of cool technology.

But! If I was in a tourist area such as Queenstown in New Zealand and got a text coupon saving me 75% on the normal price of a jet boat ride because I am close to the wharf, but I have to be there within 10 minutes. I’m on that boat.

If I am a member of the Stella Artois Happy Hour Club and I walk past a bar on Friday night and get a text coupon saying come in now and get 2 bears for the price of 1 and forward this message to your mates and we will tell them you are here and offer them the same deal, I’m in. Of course I would have already opted in and said that they can only send me deals on Friday evenings from 6 till 10 and only if I am within 500m of a bar offering a deal.

Scattergun marketing annoys me to death. I don’t want Spam about things I’m not interested in. If I can have a deal with an advertiser where I can set the rules for our communication including that they only send me things that I am genuinely interested in, I might start to like advertising.

Given the state of the world economy and the growing population, advertisers will be able to offer better deals to targetted people with much greater results and the people receiving offers will be pleased they got them. Imagine a DM Campaign that gets 30% results reliably?

]]> By: Roy S. http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9140 Roy S. Sun, 01 Jul 2007 13:01:32 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9140 @yuri; comment 2) to offer LBS to the masses you need a technology that is available and can deliver the message to the masses. In this point of time you need the co-operation of the operators to achieve that.....so service you want to offer and the technology used aren't indpendent. ARPU....such a nice telco term. Augmented Reality isn't a way to link data to a code, but to integrate artificial objects (computer generated data) and the real world. @yuri; comment 2)
to offer LBS to the masses you need a technology that is available and can deliver the message to the masses. In this point of time you need the co-operation of the operators to achieve that…..so service you want to offer and the technology used aren’t indpendent. ARPU….such a nice telco term. Augmented Reality isn’t a way to link data to a code, but to integrate artificial objects (computer generated data) and the real world.

]]> By: Yuri van Geest http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9138 Yuri van Geest Sun, 01 Jul 2007 12:21:22 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9138 Very interesting post and discussion. My thoughts: 1) Good analogy. I believe the use of LBS (commercial as well as non-commercial) will drive mobile internet/flat fee usage packages as well as drive up the phone call volumes. As a result, the ARPU will be higher in the end. I do believe the most value is in non-commercial, social networking LBS services. Examples: Crunkie, Twitter/Jaiku, Socialight, Dodgeball, Patholog etc. And these services with integrate fully with all key code vendors using AR technology, QR codes (Kaywa), barcodes, YellowArrows, ShotCodes, infrared barcodes etc. However, the commercial LBS will be there and accepted as can be seen already as we speak around the world (Korea, Japan, Italy and especially UK). E.g., mobile LBS couponing.....opt-in, permission based, targeted and the dosage/frequency is limited. 2) Cell ID, GPS and LBS. There was a comment on GPS and LBS. I don't get that point. The location technology is independent of the value of LBS (services!). Both GPS and cell ID (and aGPS, Cambridge Positioning Systems/CPS) are important but it is about the services. In sum, I agree totally with the points made by Boris. Very interesting post and discussion.

My thoughts:
1) Good analogy. I believe the use of LBS (commercial as well as non-commercial) will drive mobile internet/flat fee usage packages as well as drive up the phone call volumes. As a result, the ARPU will be higher in the end. I do believe the most value is in non-commercial, social networking LBS services. Examples: Crunkie, Twitter/Jaiku, Socialight, Dodgeball, Patholog etc. And these services with integrate fully with all key code vendors using AR technology, QR codes (Kaywa), barcodes, YellowArrows, ShotCodes, infrared barcodes etc.

However, the commercial LBS will be there and accepted as can be seen already as we speak around the world (Korea, Japan, Italy and especially UK). E.g., mobile LBS couponing…..opt-in, permission based, targeted and the dosage/frequency is limited.

2) Cell ID, GPS and LBS. There was a comment on GPS and LBS. I don’t get that point. The location technology is independent of the value of LBS (services!). Both GPS and cell ID (and aGPS, Cambridge Positioning Systems/CPS) are important but it is about the services.

In sum, I agree totally with the points made by Boris.

]]> By: mark http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9134 mark Thu, 28 Jun 2007 09:00:40 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9134 >The problem I have with most webservices being developed is that they mostly want to make money from advertising. hear hear, that's exactly my problem with most ideas. I have a hard time taking anything seriously that, in 2007, still comes up with advertising as their only revenue. I mean, how innovative is that? :-) Next to that, I'm totally fed up with every form of webadvertising, and I guess I'm not the only one. Just two days ago I went to reddit.com for instance of which I thought was quite a respectable webservice. (a project of mine was linked there, as it seemed). Until my browserwindow closed (FF 2.0) and I got a pop-up for a 'registry cleaning scan' (I was on a Mac btw). Well, I'm still pissed of about that and I'm telling it to everyone who wants to hear it. Imho there's no justice in making money if that's what you do to the people who visit you. >If a mobile operator would start a gas station they would charge you for parking, entry to the shop and cleaning your windshield. Well, imho, webadvertising is exactly that. For visiting someone's site, I get awarded with all kinds of spam. Not a nice way to treat someone. ^_^ (I guess I'm making friends now, right? ^_^) >The problem I have with most webservices being developed is that they mostly want to make money from advertising.

hear hear, that’s exactly my problem with most ideas. I have a hard time taking anything seriously that, in 2007, still comes up with advertising as their only revenue. I mean, how innovative is that? :-) Next to that, I’m totally fed up with every form of webadvertising, and I guess I’m not the only one. Just two days ago I went to reddit.com for instance of which I thought was quite a respectable webservice. (a project of mine was linked there, as it seemed). Until my browserwindow closed (FF 2.0) and I got a pop-up for a ‘registry cleaning scan’ (I was on a Mac btw). Well, I’m still pissed of about that and I’m telling it to everyone who wants to hear it. Imho there’s no justice in making money if that’s what you do to the people who visit you.

>If a mobile operator would start a gas station they would charge you for parking, entry to the shop and cleaning your windshield.

Well, imho, webadvertising is exactly that. For visiting someone’s site, I get awarded with all kinds of spam. Not a nice way to treat someone. ^_^

(I guess I’m making friends now, right? ^_^)

]]> By: Luigi Cappel http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9133 Luigi Cappel Thu, 28 Jun 2007 05:46:01 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9133 We are working in the same space in New Zealand. We provide maps and directions to and from anywhere in New Zealand on Vodafone Live. The main problem that we have in this space is that only about 6% of mobile phones in NZ are compatible. As to other services,we want to develop things like web to MMS for maps and directions but are struggling with getting access to that technology through our telco's. Personally I'm really excited about the concepts of well managed proximity based marketing and social networking as LBS. We are working in the same space in New Zealand. We provide maps and directions to and from anywhere in New Zealand on Vodafone Live. The main problem that we have in this space is that only about 6% of mobile phones in NZ are compatible. As to other services,we want to develop things like web to MMS for maps and directions but are struggling with getting access to that technology through our telco’s.

Personally I’m really excited about the concepts of well managed proximity based marketing and social networking as LBS.

]]> By: JeroenvanVelzen http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9132 JeroenvanVelzen Wed, 27 Jun 2007 21:29:15 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9132 We have had a LBS server for Vodafone until about 18 months ago. Pricing started out quite ok; 6-12 cents for a location readout. It was used by only one client (www.waarbenje.nl). 12 months ago they increased readouts tenfold to 1 Euro I believe. That putted the client out of business. Twitter with an automatic location attached could be interesting. We have had a LBS server for Vodafone until about 18 months ago. Pricing started out quite ok; 6-12 cents for a location readout. It was used by only one client (www.waarbenje.nl).

12 months ago they increased readouts tenfold to 1 Euro I believe. That putted the client out of business.

Twitter with an automatic location attached could be interesting.

]]> By: Roy S http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9129 Roy S Wed, 27 Jun 2007 19:43:33 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9129 Hi Boris, what I tried to point out is that every LBS case you read/hear about is based on targeting consumers with a marketing message. What was your plan with LBS? Can you compare it with marketing messages on the internet or in you mailbox?....the google ads you see after a search on their searchengine are mostly context-aware and sometimes because of that even helpful. The e-mails with a marketing message you receive can be either wanted or unwanted....but when are they unwanted (SPAM)? In my opinion the less the sender knows about you as a person and/or about your state of mind...the more annoying they are. The problem I have with most webservices being developed is that they mostly want to make money from advertising. I'm a " trained" ( is that bad?) internet user and 95% of the advertising I don't notice. By the way...in 3 years you don't need the operator to offer LBS because most phones will have GPS. Hi Boris,

what I tried to point out is that every LBS case you read/hear about is based on targeting consumers with a marketing message. What was your plan with LBS?

Can you compare it with marketing messages on the internet or in you mailbox?….the google ads you see after a search on their searchengine are mostly context-aware and sometimes because of that even helpful. The e-mails with a marketing message you receive can be either wanted or unwanted….but when are they unwanted (SPAM)? In my opinion the less the sender knows about you as a person and/or about your state of mind…the more annoying they are.

The problem I have with most webservices being developed is that they mostly want to make money from advertising. I’m a ” trained” ( is that bad?) internet user and 95% of the advertising I don’t notice.

By the way…in 3 years you don’t need the operator to offer LBS because most phones will have GPS.

]]> By: Boris Veldhuijzen van Zanten http://bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/comment-page-1/#comment-9128 Boris Veldhuijzen van Zanten Wed, 27 Jun 2007 19:11:45 +0000 http://www.bomega.com/2007/06/27/how-free-more-money/#comment-9128 Mark: The gas station gives away free cleaning tools so you feel better about stopping there which means they get more business. If a mobile operator would start a gas station they would charge you for parking, entry to the shop and cleaning your windshield. Mark: The gas station gives away free cleaning tools so you feel better about stopping there which means they get more business. If a mobile operator would start a gas station they would charge you for parking, entry to the shop and cleaning your windshield.

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